Ball or Griffen?
Who should my last ruck be?
Will all this talk about the Gold Coast affect Gary’s play?
Put all your questions, comments, thoughts, advice in here.
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{ 187 comments… read them below or add one }
Go Luke Ball. He has shown in the past how damaging he can be, and he will get 85-90% game time at Collingwood. He will average round 100 a game, whereas griffin is inconsistent and is a tease. He never lives up to the hype, so I’d say Ball.
Last ruck I’d say Lobbe.
THe GOld Coast talk will only spur him on to even greater achievements. All I can say is look out Essendon!!
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Ball to start with, but, Griff has a better upside, IF, he can take another step or two and match it with consistency. I’d be looking at slotting him in if he proves himself. That said, I’d rather Cooney, or even Bryce Gibbs.
I don’t think Gazza will be affected @ all, he is a gun.
I am mulling over my last ruck spot, right now it’s D.Bass with 13k to spare, I’m thinking of d/g my mid bench to get a better R4, Stanley, Lobbe, Trengove, Cordy or Roughead. I’m still not sure which way I’ll go. My plan is to get a cash cow here, but, I’m sure I’m not the only one with that idea. Maybe wait till selection?
In regard to my mid bench, I’ve got Morabito and Scully there, and I’m thinking about trading for 1 or 2 of J.Strauss, Bastinac, Shuey, Moles, L.Jetta, Banfield or Barlow for the final two spots. In my midfield, I have 4 prem’s & 2 rookies -Martin & Trengove.
Also thinking of trading Chappy for Goodes.
Any thoughts?
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Yep – cooney for sure!
also i think Chappy is a better option … Goodes move to centre half-forward this season could lower his scores
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That is a valid point, you’ve made about Goodes, although, he will be a hard match up for a lot of defensive structures, can ruck, play C/H/B, or the richo wing type role.
Chapman is a gun who WILL get injured and miss 4-8 weeks. This is my only knock on him. If he played 20-22 games, I’d almost take him in front of Gazza.
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true … hmmm O’keefe might be a better option in place of chappy!
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yes, ROK it is….cheers mate, my forward line is settled.
As soon as I sort out my R4, i’ll be a happy camper. Have Stanley there atm, still thinking about Lobbe, and, maybe Trengove, Cordy, Roughead…..decisions, decisions. What a great game this is!
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Yarran or Mayne …. hmmm .. i need a cheapish forward??
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taylor walker
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I agree….how about Walker or Rockliff?
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Rockliff all day
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although i have both, i’d say rockliff will have a harder time fighting for spots in the best 22. walker on the other hand will play all 22 games unless injured
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I got both Walker and Rockliff, now I’m thinking about my last forward spot…R.Roberts or J.Podsiadly? Both have great upsides imo.
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Mitchell or Pendlebury……………
Ablett or Bastinac………………?
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pendlebury and lol
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If anyone’s interested….355900
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and..305647
although, there are only 5 or 6 spots left.
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Barry Hall or Dangerfield??
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Dangerfield. I like him, but I like Robert Murphy even more ( :
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ohhh decisions decisions .. i have $61k in the bank and dont know how to change!!!! I’ve got selwood as my 2nd forward (after Ablett) .. think he is good enough? or do i need Swan?
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*who* to change …
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if you mean Joel, then, either is a good option. J.S is an awesome player. I’ve gone Swan myself b/c I’m a Pies man and b/c he is a ball magnet who works and runs so hard and can deal with a tag.
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also .. do you have Nic Nat??
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Danger, hall will be very up and down.
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Thanks – yep gone with danger
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yep, have nic nat.
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Mark Williams or Paul Medhurst – can’t decide, toss of a coin maybe!
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My team is almost sorted. just stuck on these last few things
Hitchcock or Roberts (due to play round 1 I believe)
What do you guys think of Betts? Had a great pre-season and is a lovely price. Would have to take out Gia to get him in though.
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Betts’ history has been like that tho, really good at the start of the season and falls away. but this year he does have a point to prove.
Dont know about d/g Gia for him tho….
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i barrack for the blues and i have gia …
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do u think Gibbs is a good option for 3rd midfielder … dont quite have enough cash for selwood etc ..
my midfield is Ablett, Swan, Gibbs, Cooney, Robinson, Martin (Barlow, Bastinac)
any thoughts?
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I’d go with Gibbs, he’s a gun! I’ve backed him at $61 to win the Brownlow! He won’t get tagged as that is reserved for Judd and or Murphy so will get loose and he has one of the best kicks in the game so will score well.
With that sort of pump up you’d think I had him in my team but I don’t, I went with Mitchell instead…
Solid midfield though, not convinced on Robinson however still think he might be a little inconsistent.
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Classy m/f… keep Gibbs, not sure about M.R though, do you see him as a cash cow? Mind you, I’ve not seen a lot of his footy, just remember he started well last year b4 tapering off…
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thanks
Mitch has had an awesome preseason and looks ready to fire!!! he is 3rd fittest at the club (behind walker and Kruezer)
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Massive spend in your midfield. With what little money you have left you may be able to recruit the Moorabin under 13′s to fill the holes up front and back. At a buy price of $5.80, a packet of Samboy chips and the weekend loan of a dog eared playboy mag from 84 you might just be able to squeeze a few of the young fellas in.
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actually no – i’ve got goddard, hodge, enright, reiwoldt, O’keefe, harvey etc etc etc … easily 2200 per week …
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S+V or Cheese & Onion Samboys ( ;
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Sorry Happy only those dodgy kebab flavoured things from that ordinary competition they ran. They could be a little bit stale as well.
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Drew Petrie breaks foot!
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/petrie-out-with-broken-foot/story-e6frf9jf-1225844684758
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what do you guys think about B.Stanton, had a freakish two games in preseason, can he perform like that in the real thing though?
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I’m a Dons fan (missed 3 games in 11 years!). No, no & no to Stanton!! He butches the ball something cronic and has always got the hands out to receive. Must admit though, has added scoring goals to his limited skills. Should never have been given the Number 5 – DISGRACEFUL!!
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im a bombers man and i agree with you on you call…he does turn it over alot…and i would have saved the number 5 for someone with a bit of class in them…
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and I am also a little concerned with Dangerfield’s scores over preseaon, his average of 58.0 looks nothing compared to Medhurst’s 98.3 average for a little cheaper… can Medhurst return to his season average of 88 in 2008?
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Is there more upside to Ziebell as an option (also FWD/MID)
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I DEF think Medhurst will get back to, or improve on his 2008 form. He didn’t do a preseason last year, and has done a full one this year. Malthouse wont cop his freo flakiness so there is no issue there, so for me, its Medhurst.
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thanks happy, good bit of info there… locking him in
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Penders or J Selwood people??? Possible last minute change to my 104th confirmed team!!
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I’ve got Selwood in the team over Pendles, think Selwood has a good crack at the Brownlow this season
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Both are guns. Not sure it really matters.
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Selwood will get a bucket load of frees and that adds up nicely.
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Swiper, how do you rate Cale Hooker? He’s also impressed in preseason, with scores of 99, 113, 106… at 331,600 thats a fair bit of value there
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Nice defender MJ, but there is no way he’ll maintain that average. Handballs quite a bit. Don’t like him for SC, but should be a 10 year player for the Bombers. Personally, I’d stay away. I’d go Kennelly over him. Form looks good thus far and body is right
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I’ve got Kennelly also, could just go with the more common bet of Ladson or Hunt
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Has Silvagni from Freo been upgraded from the Rookie list? Need to know if he’ll play this week… Nason from Richmond an option instead? Any other ideas below 100K for DEF?
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there aren’t too many this year, if you don’t have Maguire, he’s also a good option for the bench, but Nason and Silvagni are the best two young ones i think. Have to wait for the team lists to come out for them
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or Webberley as well, he could get picked this week
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Cheers mate, got Maguire so I might be forced into Nason I think
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what about Will Young (ade)?
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Gilbee or Harbrow in the backline?
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toughie that one….both have poor scores in pre season. i would still go Gilbee though. How about Macdonald/Carazzo??
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Thought about them but wanted one of the Doggies because they will get it and use it well. Leaning towards Harbrow purely for the fact he is about 7k cheaper, can’t split them really.
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Gilbes easily he’s da doggies QB and can play in the midfield along with kicking a 50m goal. Gibes Hands down.
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Hitchcock or Robets? both good chance to play round 1 but who will make more cash and who will play more games?
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Can someone help me decide between RHYCE SHAW & LINDSAY GILBEE for my 3rd defender?
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shaw… looks like he might play more up the field this year
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Hmmm anyone help me suggest a 300-400k defender? Not sure if i should keep Malceski and have 170k left over or trade him up for someone like MacDonald
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Maybe Mackie what does everyone think about him?
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I think Malceski could be a real smokie, cheap as chips and recovered from his knee op.
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Every man and his dog will be taking Esky in their team.
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Here is the real question I need answered, in my starting 22 am I better to have
DEF: Gilbee and MID: McVeigh
or should I go with
DEF: Maquire and MID: Joel Selwood
????
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Maguire Selwood
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Just remember Mark McVeigh won’t play this week.
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Hi, I’m new to this, first time playing.
Was wondering if could have some advice.
So far I’ve got:
Defense:
1. Goddard, B
2. Hodge, L
3. Macdonald, J
4. Gram, J
5. Kennelly, T
6. Hunt, J
7. Farmer, M
23. Waters, B
24. Maguire, M
Mid:
8. Ablett, G
9. Bartel, J
10. Gibbs, B
11. Ball, L
12. Dangerfield, P
13. Trengove, J
25. Martin, D
26. Moles, B
Rucks:
14. McIntosh, H
15. Hille, D
27. Warnock, R
28. Skipper, W
Forwards:
16. Riewoldt, N
17. Pavlich, M
18. Gray, R
19. Hall, B
20. Medhurst, P
21. Smith, J
22. Wonaeamirri, A
29. Rockliff, T
30. Podsiadly, J
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Is Jolly and Naitanui a better option than Mcintosh and Hille?
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WARNING!
PETRIE BROKE HIS FOOT AT TRAINING TODAY!
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A three rookie midfield and a fairly good forward line, or two rookie midfield and average forward line?
Also, what are opinions on having R. Shaw, Malceski and Kennelly in the backline together? Too much Swannies?
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Swap R for H Shaw their the same price.
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For my midfield who should I choose
D. Rich, R. Griffin, S.Higgins or L.Gilbee
I think Rich personally as he’ll have a bigger year this year. Hopefully improving on his for from 09.
Also do you think it’s a good move to pick Henderson in my squad, or wait for him to gain match confidence, and pick him up later at a cheaper price.
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Hey guys just one thing please, masten or dangerfield?
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dangerfield
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hey guys who do u think is the best forward that you can get for $236,100
that will definately play in their teams 22 every week
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Is this for on field or reserves?
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on field
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Hmm, sorry but there is no one that i can think of under that price that will get 22 games or gather a decent amount of points.
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Jack Steven might be worth a punt, otherwise, go a rookie..Scully, Trengove etc
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Yarran at $239,900 should play every game, but you’ve got to find $4K. Maybe chew the fat from your interchange.
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Yarran definitely has a lot of upside.
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thanks, considering him
whats your thoughts on rohan and rockliffe
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Everybody loves Ray, oops I mean Rockliffe inc me.
Rohan has big wraps but I want to see him a few times b4 I make a committment.
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Forwards $200-300k Poll will be up later tonight. Any suggestions for options?
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Walker, Ballantyne, Polak are the obvious ones I spose.
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S.Edwards, C.Mayne, B.Staker, B.Warren, C.Yarran, B.McCaffer, T.Hentschel, P.Vezpremi
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Hi guys,
Mitch Farmer, Matt maquire or Beau waters as my 7th def?
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All are good choices imo and are in my b/l, although, I do have McGuire on my bench.
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what does everybody think of R.Roberts from Richmond
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I like him and have been weighing up my final forward position b/w him and Podsiadly. I have Pods @ the moment, but….
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I’d go Waters with Maguire in your first bench spot. You won’t be Robinson Crusoe doing that tho.
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Hello everybody,
I signed up to supercoach, after being coaxed by my workmates ~ who are guys and promised to help me out given I am new to the whole supercoach thing.
Obviously the boys offered me little help, as we are playng for money. As a result I was hoping that you all could please review (or rate) my team below. I would really (really) appreciate and comments / feedback on areas that I can improve.
Defenders: Goddard / Enright / Hodge / Kennelley / Hunt / Waters / Maguire (Emerg~ Nason / Silvangi)
Mid-Field: Ablett / Swan / Gibbs / Cooney / Trengove / Martin (Emerg~ Barlow / Banner)
Rucks: Sandilands / Naitanui (Emerg~ Warnock / Lobbe)
Forwards: Riewoldt / O’Keefe / Higgins / Franklin / Dangerfield / Ziebell / Medhurst (Emerg~ Rockliff / Podsiadly)
Thanks again.
Leesa
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How long have you been reading this site for Leesa? That is an EXCELLENT team. In fact, I can’t offer you anything that would improve it. Ladies and Gentlemen, we have a 10/10.
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WOW! (Really!!)
Thank-you so much.
I have not been reading your site for long, started today actually ~ my co-workers rave about it though, so I thought I should check it out. After reading the content though, I think this site will help me out all season.
Hopefully I win, I’ll share the cash with you Motts
Thanks again.
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You can keep the cash, Leesa. Knowing you’re getting value out of what for me is a labour of love is payment enough.
(Exactly how MUCH cash are talking about though?)
Spread the good word about the site. The more the merrier!
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Looks pretty good. Although the back line is just that little too light with maguire on the field. It’s a bit risky but if you don’t take risks that just leaves in the same place as everyone else.
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words of wisdom. thanks again.
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Two Cheapies in your backline might be a hit or miss.
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I’m glad to hear the 10/10 as it is similar to my line up bar a few differences which are:
Gilbbe for Kennelley
Mitchell for Swan
and B Harvey for Higgins
and a couple of the emergencies
Agree with the backline comments it concerns me having Maquire on the field but I am hoping he plays well enough early to get the cash up and then I can trade up when the time is right. I thought it was a risk worth taking to have the extra premium midfielder!
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She has to make sacrifices for that midfield. And she’s picked the cream of the crop.
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Personally I’m calling Ablett overpriced. Swan is a walk-up Captain, do you need Ablett as well? I’d look at Pendlebury, Mitchell, Bartel or Selwood instead of Ablett.
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Just caught report on Adelaide TV news (Ch7, I think – was switching between the 2) that Gray is in doubt with back soreness. Also, Motlop (if you are crazy enough to pick him) didn’t train with the main group despite being cleared of hamstring damage. 2nd ruck still up in the air – they may opt for Westhoff and D Stewart to support Brogan, leaving Lobbe in the wilderness.
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Cooney or Higgins!?
This will be my final ‘tuch-up’ of my team then should be done
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whats everyone’s thoughts on stanton at $507,500
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and how do ya reckon dal santo and J.selwood will go this year
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Nah not Stanton, well it’s your choice, but I’d go with Cooney or HIggins, I think they’re better value and in a good team. Selwood should step up again this year
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Guns, both of them. They will dominate like they did last year.
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ok cool, thanks
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do u know if trengove will play most games this year
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or should i go with barlow as a starting rookie in the middle
keeping in mind i already have martin
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Final team RD1
Defenders
J.Gram, M.Firrito, H.Taylor, S.Stevens, C.Hooker, J.Frawley, B.Waters (P.Davis(EMER), A.Silvagni)
Mid
D.Swan(C), J.Selwood, R.O’Keefe, J.Watson, L.Anthony, M.Barlow(B.Moles, R.Bastinac)
Ruck
A.Sandilands, N.Naitanui(M.Lobbe,S.Grimely)
FWD
N.Riewoldt(VC), R.Gray, S.Byrnes, K.Tippett, E.Betts, B.Hall, P.Medhurst(R.Roberts(EMER), J.Podsiadly)
Bank- $23,000
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I’m not sure which is the braver move, no Gaz, or no Robbie Warnock!
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PLZ rate and i am open to any opinions or advice
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The backline is really light on, 4s.
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i think i have the right mix in def
J.Frawley-Up and coming player-top Melbourne defender
J.Gram- Great last year should be the new S.Fisher while he is injured and can kick goals.
H.Taylor- performed well last year and was robbed of the norm smith medal for his job on Riewoldt in the GF.
S.Stevens- had a very very impressive season for Adelaide last year and will also go forward and kick goals.
M.Firrito- Had a huge year for NM and almost won the clubs B&F. also runs in the mid.
C.Hooker- Very impressive in NAB and i think will be a top young talent for Essendon, along with M.Hurley.
B.Waters- Last two games of NAB were great he is worth is price tag.
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Is this news true about Robbie Gray
And is it wise to have Brent Stanton in the mids?
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wat news??
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about back soreness
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haven’t heard anything
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Scan up to my previous post.
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Guys do you think Cyril Rioli and Lecras will perform consistently this season?
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hey everyone this is my team so far, would really appreciate any comments / feedback on areas i can improve
Defenders: Goddard / Enright / Hodge / Melceski / Hunt / Ladson / Waters (Emerg~ Silvangi / White)
Mid-Field: Ablett / Swan / Dal Santo / Selwood / Martin / Barlow (Emerg~ kayler t, mcneil)
Rucks: Hille / Naitanui (Emerg~ Lobbe / Mcnamara)
Forwards: /???/ Riewoldt / O’Keefe / Higgins / Dangerfield / Ziebell / Medhurst (Emerg~ Rockliff / Podsiadly)
also wondering who i should put in for my last forward spot i’m thinking chappy. (i have $623,300 left)
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I’d go Pav or Giansiracusa
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and upgrade one of Malceski, Hunt or ladson
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ok thanks, which one do u reckon i should upgrade ladson, melceski or hunt?
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Ladson if Malceski plays
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upgrade two of Malceski / Hunt / Ladson / Waters to say carrazzo/heath shaw/duffield
that is a supercoach nightmare waiting to happen
downgrade one of ablett and swan to say a bartel or mitchell for extra cash
Also could use this cash to upgrade medhurst
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Risky having those 4 cheap defenders on the field as they are all returning from serious injuries… could be prone to reoccurance
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yeah good point
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Team update:
Backs:
Goodwin, Drummond, Enright, Hodge, Kennelly, Waters, Maguire
(Nason, Silvagni)
Mids:
Pendlebury, J.Selwood, Gibbs, Ball, Martin, Barlow
(Banner, Bastinac)
Rucks:
Clark, Hille
(Warnock, Lobbe)
Forwards:
Reiwoldt, O’Keefe, Franklin, Gray, Tippett, Hall, Medhurst
(Rockliff, Podsiadly)
Bank: $15 000
Any notable issues with it? Apart from the injury query on Gray and the 2 cheap players (Maguire and Waters) on the field in defense.
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Gram vs Carrazzo?
Capt choice for round 1…
J. Selwood vs Dons
or
S.Mitchell vs Deez?
Any suggestions?
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Gram
Selwood
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Guys
Finally decided that GAJ is too much of a risk given the downside if he announces he’s signed with GC17. Consequently, I’ve come up with a strategy out of left field that I’d appreciate your criticism of (constructive or not.)
Goddard, Enright, Hurn, Hodge, Gram, Hunt, Maguire (Nason, Silvagni)
NDS, Pendles, Ball, Robinson, Martin, Barlow (Shuey, Banner)
Clark, Ryder (Warnock, McAuley)
Roo, ROK, Boomer, Higgins, Gray, Tippet, Rockliffe (Pods, Hitchcock)
Strategy based on 16 keepers, 6 rooks requiring 12 trades to upgrade to premium, 6 trades for injuries and 2 left for my PS keepers that don’t make the grade.
Main thinking is that history shows SC is won and lost in trade strategy during the year and the mid-pricers this year are not value.
What are your thoughts?
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What’s the downside if GAJ signs with GC17? Do you think Bomber won’t play him?
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luke ball or brent prismall for 5th mid spot ?? thourghts guys ??
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or ben mcglynn ??
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ben mcglynn or adam selwood ??
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I think there’ll be backlash from the players, coach and club – ala what has happened in the NRL with the mid-season trade window.
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You just made me trade him out for Lenny. I hope you’re happy.
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If you’re serious I’d reconsider Lenny given his niggle. On GAJ – why wouldn’t he at least give an indication that he was staying if that is his intent? He’s already met with GC17 and Pickering’s public backlash against Bomber’s comment at the launch sealed it for me.
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you sure on the deano ?? reckon ablett will be trash this year ? could make him hungyer to stick it to everyone
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I think he’s overpriced even if he stays, throw in a possible move and that’s even more downside. HOWEVER, think sideways and grab another Cat instead. Bartel and Selwood will see a lot more of the ball if Gaz drops 15 touches a game.
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who would be your captian then if you leave GAJ out???
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hmmmm so you reckon trade GAJ for bartel ?
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or maybe sam mitchell
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I’ve gone NDS however I’ve also been able to bring in Goddard and have Pendles as backup
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Thanks Motts.
I am still quite new to this so this might be a very noob question but…
If Juddy doesn’t play the first 3 games, do they count as 0′s? and price comes down, or does he actually have to play for it to count?
Die hard Blues fan so I feel bad leaving him out
I’m basically keeping Mitchell in in their until Juddy comes back 
lol
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Players have to play for it to count, mate.
And that’s precisely the right strategy. Hopefully Mitchell will go up a bit while you’ve got him and make you some $$$.
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luke ball brent prismal ben mcglynn or adam selwood 477k in the bank ????
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Ball or if you want to take the risk, McGlynn.
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B: GODDARD, BOCK, H.SHAW, R.SHAW, HODGE, GILBEE, WATERS
M: ABLETT, SELWOOD, BARTEL, MITCHELL, COONEY, MARTIN
R: TIPPETT, HILLE
F; CHAPMAN, REIWOLDT, DIDAK, ROUGHEAD, HALL, DANGERFIELD, WARREN
all emergencies are the cheapest available
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Interested in the All Girl League I’m putting together Kylie? Do me a favour and register your interest or otherwise on the post. Ta!
Team looks good – just make sure you pick emergencies that are going to play early.
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yes i will join
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by the way that was my team if i had 11 million instead of 10
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I thought it was a bit OTT!
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Had me wondering what unbelievable strategy you were playing!!!
Make sure you pick good rookie emergencies as they are the ones that will make you money and enable upgrades which is the name of the game.
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LOL!
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Motts i was thinking about trades near the end of the year and figured out that teams will rest higher priced players and not many mid priced players, so picking mid priced players who won’t be rested i think could be a good strategy, i’ve applied this to my defence
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yeah ive got that in place also i like it
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4s
Once you’ve consulted your crystal ball, please let us know who those mid pricers are. The only team that used this last year was the Saints and I venture to say that Rossy has learned the lesson of “flirting with your form”
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if u remember Geelong also did this against Brisbane after they played Saints
Anyway the mid priced defenders are- Gram, Firrito, H.Taylor, S.Stevens, C.Hooker
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Dunx
If it was totally up to GAJ then I’m sure he’d shine as he did last year when Timmy W questioned his willingness to find the contested ball. The difference is that he may be isolated by his team-mates/club/supporters. The $1.5M question for me is does the downside outweigh any upside? Clear answer is youbetcha!
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rhmmmm right NDS based on that, but i dunno he could come out with guns blazing………
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ablett out for NDS after deano and spooner have made me
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or sam mitchell, ryan okeefe who your money on?
anyone else ?
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Watson
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ok ablett for watson swan capt
then upgrade luke ball for ??????????????
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anthony, Swallow, Stanton, vince, Sherman or K.Cornes
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or upgrade ladson for 469 in the bank ?? which would i be better of doing upgrading a middle or a backman ??
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who are your backs and who are yr mids
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backs h shaw l hodge l gilbee t kenelly s selwood r ladson b waters emg r schonermakers m maguire
mids at the moment d swan (capt) j watson j selwood b gibbs l ball emf j trengrove m barlow
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i’d upgrade ladson for probably Harbrow or Mattner if u have $469,000
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yeah not josh gibson jason gram??
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yeah i have him in my team as well as firrito
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which one whas that haha who would be bes in your opinion???/
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Gram
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going with mattner
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C’mon guys – please give me some feedback on my team posted about an hour ago!
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put your team up again deano ill have a look
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Guys
Finally decided that GAJ is too much of a risk given the downside if he announces he’s signed with GC17. Consequently, I’ve come up with a strategy out of left field that I’d appreciate your criticism of (constructive or not.)
Goddard, Enright, Hurn, Hodge, Gram, Hunt, Maguire (Nason, Silvagni)
NDS, Pendles, Ball, Robinson, Martin, Barlow (Shuey, Banner)
Clark, Ryder (Warnock, McAuley)
Roo, ROK, Boomer, Higgins, Gray, Tippet, Rockliffe (Pods, Hitchcock)
Strategy based on 16 keepers, 6 rooks requiring 12 trades to upgrade to premium, 6 trades for injuries and 2 left for my PS keepers that don’t make the grade.
Main thinking is that history shows SC is won and lost in trade strategy during the year and the mid-pricers this year are not value.
What are your thoughts?
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Can’t fault your thinking, d. Looking at the team I’d have to give it a 10 because the only thing I could offer up as advice is that MAYBE Gray is injured. It’s just as likely though that kb was simply trying to get an edge on the competition by filing false reports.
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do you think Hayes is going to have a good year ???
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